Prof. Bogusław Smólski, director of the National Center for Research and Development (NCBiR) in Warsaw, talks to Danuta Górecka.

There's a long list of institutions that deal with science in Poland today. These include the Ministry of Science and Higher Education, the Polish Academy of Sciences (PAN), the National Contact Point (KPK), and a host of smaller scientific and research units. In July, yet another institution of this kind was established: the National Center for Research and Development. Why do we need so many different institutions to handle these matters?

All these institutions are active in different areas. The ministry and its responsibilities differ from the Polish Academy of Sciences and its tasks as a scientific organization. The individual institutes operating within the Polish Academy of Sciences are yet another thing. The National Contact Point is even more dissimilar. Its main task is to spread knowledge on European Union programs. Each of these organizations has its place in Poland.

In answer to your question regarding the need for a government agency concerned with the management of scientific research, let me first make a general statement: Poland was one of the few remaining countries in Europe where financing and supervising research projects was the concern of the minister responsible for science.

What are the main tasks of the National Center for Research and Development?

The assumptions are as follows: research policy and strategy will ultimately rest in the hands of the minister of science. However, the management and financing of scientific research is to be passed on to two government agencies. The first agency, the National Center for Research and Development, is already in operation; its main job is in applied research. The other agency will be responsible for financing and organizing basic research.

The main area of activity of the National Center for Research and Development will be the implementation of strategic R&D programs for scientific research as well as development work. These programs will be established by the minister in charge of science, within the framework of the National Program of Scientific Research and Development (KPBNiPR). Another priority involves the application of R&D project results in the economy. The task of the center will be to create platforms for collaboration in this specific area between the scientific community, industry and business. The National Center for Research and Development will also work to create the best possible conditions for the development of Polish scientists. Moreover, under the law regulating its operations, the National Center for Research and Development will undertake other tasks commissioned by the minister responsible for science. The first such task involves assuming supervision over several dozen key projects defined in the Innovative Economy Operational Program (POIG).

Why is the establishment of the National Center for Research and Development so important? Regardless of how many organizations in Poland claim to function on the scientific market, some 60-70 percent of all funds spent on research come from the state budget. This means a low level of participation on the part of companies and entrepreneurs in financing research. The European Commission publishes an annual ranking of 1,000 European companies that participate in funding research. The 2006 league table included only two Polish companies, the telecommunications giant Telekomunikacja Polska SA and the KGHM copper company. They were ranked in the fourth and eighth hundred respectively. In terms of money, out of a total figure of approximately 112 billion euros spent by the 1,000 companies, the share of the two Polish businesses is a mere 40 million euros, or 0.036 percent. This illustrates the situation we are facing.

Our reality can also be described in terms of relatively low spending on science. Obviously, there are reasons for this; there is history, and there are references to other needs. However, in spite of the growth that has taken place over the past two years, we are still dealing with a very low 0.6 percent share of research expenditure in the country's gross domestic product. Thanks to European Union programs, there is a chance that the resources provided by the state for research-over zl.4 billion next year-will be increased by at least one-half in the coming years.

The National Center for Research and Development is intended to create a new situation on the research market in Poland. A new element in implementing the state's scientific policy will be the designation of a part of the budgetary funds for strategic research programs. This money will address the country's needs in the area of technological development as well as public needs.

How will that work technically? Will the National Center for Research and Development develop such strategic programs?

The National Program of Scientific Research and Development is being developed as a new version of the National Framework Program (KPR) currently in existence. The new program will identify priority areas for research.

The building of a knowledge-based economy, a strategic objective of the government's scientific, scientific/technological, and innovative policy, requires a stream of funding directed at scientific research and development in those fields and disciplines that have the greatest impact on the country's social and economic development. The National Program of Scientific Research and Development will serve as a basis for making decisions on assigning budgetary resources to research projects. The main aim of the program will be to give direction to scientific research and development and create opportunities to accelerate sustainable growth in the economy.

Who will decide which fields are encompassed by strategic programs? What will the next phases of the procedure involve?

The minister responsible for science will decide which programs go first. Strategic programs, still in a general form, will be forwarded to the National Center for Research and Development, where tasks will be defined for implementation within those programs. The best research teams capable of getting the job done will be identified by way of competition. The selection procedure will be supported by a team of experts. Our intention is that these teams also include foreign experts.

As regards the process of managing major research projects, we plan to apply something novel. We intend to identify program directors by way of competition and then offer them several-year contracts. We are currently completing work on procedures that will define ways of implementing programs, paying attention to the possibility of facilitating the inclusion of businesspeople, future beneficiaries, in every phase of the process. This means that starting from the task defining and development phase, we will be seeking partners from industry interested in the results of our studies. A very important part of this process is detailing the final targets so that the studies' results do not become just another product that is shelved indefinitely. At this point, I would like to underscore once again that a priority area of interest for the National Center for Research and Development is applied research with a clear emphasis on public utility.

How large a budget will be available to those who win a contest related to a strategic program?

The estimated budget for a strategic program will be no less than zl.100 million. Obviously, such programs will span many years. The important thing is to create an efficient system for managing the programs. Correlating the management process and the financing of research projects with other forms of supporting domestic research-including funds earmarked for research infrastructure-is important for efficient changes in the utilization of all resources designated for research.

Such a program may take two to five years to carry out. All phases can be well designed and monitored, but the program may be halted at some point because someone in Europe got ahead of us and buying abroad becomes more economical than continued work. Simply put, a precisely planned project might just not work out. Is such an approach economical?

All research endeavors are high-risk ventures. This explains why assessing the risk of failure at every phase of program execution is extremely important.

No less important is the preliminary phase of developing a program so that tasks remain relevant to challenges standing before world science, while simultaneously making it possible to identify or strengthen Polish specialties. This does not mean we do not undertake work to adapt the achievements of world science to Polish needs if economic or social reasons favor such an approach.

How do you intend to encourage businesses to participate in research projects?

We are going to strive to get potential manufacturers interested in working together to carry out the programs. This includes financial involvement. It is important to pre-define the target of a program during the preliminary phases of formulating objectives and tasks. Well-defined final objectives will certainly help in activating the community of Polish manufacturers and financial institutions, bringing about their active participation in the process.

What about those research programs that are already being carried out, but were not taken into account by the Ministry of Science? Many research centers and institutes have developed specific technologies and prototypes, and have won awards at international exhibitions, but cannot find a manufacturer. Will the National Center for Research and Development help them?

What we have been talking about up to now mainly relates to strategic programs, the most important ones. At the same time, our legislative obligation is to support ambitious research projects that are or will be undertaken at universities, research and development units, and the Polish Academy of Sciences institutes. The National Center for Research and Development will soon assume supervision over newly initiated commissioned research projects. Similarly, in the not too distant future, we will assume supervision of development programs. We will also represent some Polish consortiums involved in major research ventures within the framework of European programs.

We are open to all new research initiatives from the scientific community. Even though contractors will still be selected through competitions, as the basic legal formula, research projects that are promising in terms of application of results will be analyzed and financed.

Efficient implementation of research programs depends on the creativity and talent of scientists and research workers. But talent alone is not enough. It must be cultivated and supported. Will the National Center for Research and Development provide such support?

We are legally obligated to support the mobility of scientific staff, especially young scientists. We are supposed to create the most favorable conditions possible so they can develop their talent. We are also expected to facilitate the participation of Polish scientists in national and international research programs.

We must face concrete problems. For example, there has been an insufficient number of students taking up exact sciences or engineering majors in Poland for some time now. There is a need to act urgently to meet the needs in terms of attracting an appropriate level of human resources in these fields. Moreover, we know that the size of the Polish research community is insufficient. It requires renewal and supplementing. The National Center for Research and Development sees an opening for accomplishing its mission in this area. Another important matter is action aimed at solving existing problems related to the use of scientific research results for commercial purposes.

What is the reason for these problems?

In my view, one of the reasons behind the imperfection of our system is the structure of small- and medium-sized businesses. Moreover, we have a limited set of support instruments at our disposal. Family businesses made up of a handful of people dominate among potential innovators. No such company is capable of financing or even co-financing research. Without support from the state, without appropriate funds aimed at financial support for ventures as risky as research, such companies can only be secondary users of innovative solutions. Recent times have seen the appearance of certain support tools, especially in the sphere of financing. These include the new Innovation Act as well as a project on the part of the minister for science and higher education under the name "Technological Initiative." They are working to improve the situation, but they are not enough to bring about the much-needed, radical changes in this field.

Apart from funds, what are we missing the most in science-industry relations?

Among the things we lack is mutual understanding as well as specialized brokerage companies that link together the needs of industry and science. Being familiar with the expectations of individual businesspeople as well as the potential available in research laboratories, they act as intermediaries in matching partners and in suggesting to scientists just what is really needed on the market.

Countries that have been successful in developing such a system, also boast numerous successes in the field of putting research results to commercial use. Such a system has yet another quality. In reality, innovation is regional in nature. It is at the regional level that research centers and industry work together, with the support of the local government.

Will the National Center for Research and Development help establish brokerage companies and match partners between science and industry?

The center will undertake tasks in this area as well. Putting scientific research results to commercial use is a legislatively assigned part of our mission. We will take action in supporting efficient solutions and initiatives that will guarantee the ultimate success of the projects.

In its work, will the center take advantage of the experience of the West or is it developing its own mechanisms?

Poland's needs in this field are enormous. Unfortunately, the delays are considerable, so expectations for quick change are understandable. I recently had an opportunity to visit Silicon Valley in the United States in the company of university rectors. Silicon Valley is the undisputed world leader in the area of modern technology. We had many meetings and spoke with many people concerned with the transfer of knowledge and technology as well as support for academic entrepreneurship. All these people stressed that changes in mentality, especially in the scientific community, as well as the process of launching effective mechanisms for stimulating entrepreneurship, take many years. We can wisely draw from their experience, which can be transferred to Polish soil. It is not possible to take care of everything in half a year. Not everything can be adopted directly. We have a few good models in Europe, including the examples of Finland and Ireland. But these models too are tied in with the realities of those countries. In Finland, for example, it was easier to create priorities because the Finns started from a different level of technological development. Nokia appeared as a well-defined program, but it was preceded by effective and wise strategies that involved significant spending on education for many years.

The Polish research community is very dispersed. This is not the fault of the community, but of the system that was in force to date. It is not surprising that in a situation in which there was a lack of well-defined priorities and major research ventures, individual scientific teams tried their own hand at finding themselves a place in the research world. Some were successful and achieved extraordinary results. However, the problem of scale remains. Large-scale operations provide opportunities for joining global systems. Duplicating results discovered somewhere else in the world might be fascinating, but in reality it only strengthens the position of experts, providing no opportunities for real development.

We want the programs we will be managing to play a creative role. They should be related to planned competitive solutions on the global market. Because of their importance we hope they have an integrating influence on the Polish research community. They should foster collaboration by creating platforms of real joint action by individual research teams. Only in this way can Polish science create the potential to be competitive. This does not mean that only major teams can compete. There are fields where teams made up of several people are excellent at carving out a place for themselves in global science and technology.

What are the criteria for selecting staff for the National Center for Research and Development, and how many people will ultimately be employed?

We are assuming that, in the first phase, there will be about 60 people, mainly scientists and management specialists. We are building a team of analysts that we need so badly in Poland, a team that can determine if a proposed research project meets the criteria of originality against the backdrop of world research. We are building strong teams of experts with the participation of foreign specialists. We are inviting prominent scientists, but also businesspeople and financiers, to join. The objective for the National Center for Research and Development is to become a modern and efficient government agency that performs its assigned tasks in a professional manner.

You are a renowned specialist in telecommunications. Has administration become your new challenge?

I've already worked in this area before. The organization and management of science is just as fascinating as research work. My resumé identifies several years when I was involved in managing research at the Ministry of Defense. It was a time when our armed forces were entering a period of technological transformation, which is still under way. We were joining NATO. There were endless challenges. My biography also includes the job of rector of the Military Academy of Technology (WAT) in Warsaw. Experience and pragmatism were very useful in all these activities.

What's your main area of interest in telecommunications?

Microwaves. These are very, very short waves that have some special qualities used in telecommunications, radar systems and medicine, where they are used to study changes in the human body. This is an extremely interesting research area that is well developed in Poland and requires advanced technology, especially in the area of measuring techniques.

The National Center for Research and Development has a multitude of tasks to perform. They start with the development of a coherent framework for action and extend all the way to carrying out tasks assigned by legislators. Ultimate success depends on many factors. Which one do you think is the most important?

Apart from the performance of tasks stemming from the center's mission, it is also important to influence people's habits, including students, researchers and entrepreneurs. Americans say that the most difficult thing is to persuade a prominent scientist, who is talking about his successes with the help of a slide show, to use five slides to show the importance of the discovery, and another five to present its practical applications. The usual situation, not only in the Polish research community, is for the scientist to show nine slides describing the discovery's importance and only one which suggests that it may find application in practice. The mentality of our businesspeople must be changed. It's true that licenses can be bought from elsewhere in the world, but it is seldom possible to obtain the latest products in this way. Those who have already taken the appropriate steps know the value of smart investments in research and know that it is great business.